Well i guess it all depends on what you believe in you cant change anyones opinion because we have no proof of him existing or not.

Even if he didn't exist it still gives people that bit of hope that there's something greater for us after death. It also gives comfort, I'm not religious but it's all very nice ^.^

gat

I am Jesus, whats up?

hey Buddha here, how is heaven?
joke aside, I guess people do receive comfort from knowing or believing, I would rather be at comfort with myself knowing something proven.

Omnidevil

gat

I am Jesus, whats up?

hey Buddha here, how is heaven?
joke aside, I guess people do receive comfort from knowing or believing, I would rather be at comfort with myself knowing something proven.

Ofcourse, people go to church every sunday and try to be a good person in life, only to be aworded for there good behavior by been excepted into heaven, and that God will take care of them while they are here on Earth.If you ask me dosen't it seem to be selfish, not love for God, but just to do it to benifit themselfs, so Chruch people must be the most selfish people, rgiht? (not all ofthem ofcourse)


This puts the quastion if Jesus realy existed. Would son of God come here to Earth and promise people that if they behave themselfs they be protected by God and taken to Heaven. That to me sounds more like a politician making a promise. It sounds like it was wrighten by some one and spread around the world, for one purpose and one purpose only; for people to be friends with each other and do good things in life, or be sent to hell. LOL I mean come on why do people treat a bible as such a holly thing, or the church, or the drawn/ made gessed image of Jesus, when no one knows what he looked like, if jesus was to comeback he be like; who tha fuck is this? It don't even look like me! You people been warshiping some guy with long hair and a lot of muscle.

Well i'm not starting in disscusion here. I was christian from the day i born and i always questioned many things that people were afraid of questioning by themselves. Finally i found that my place is not religion specially christianism. I believe in the historical Jesus. But i dont believe him as the son of God (if there is a god like in the bible). Maybe i'm wrong. But in any case if there exist a god that will send me to eternal danmation and pain just because my mind (the one he supposely gave me) tells me something is wrong with the bible, i prefer keep believing that he doesn't exist. -_-

Yes he does and he wont get out of my house he hsa been hiding under my bed for three days now.

Beliefs are Opinions.

Everyone has one, none can be proven the word itself should be cut from the dictonary when talking about imaginary friends.

I have heard "without dought there is no faith" and the scientific view to things is also lovley
i try to look at things with more of the buddist nature... if i see it in front of me ... it's there it exist in that moment, what waz or is to come is only a belief ...

<b>and peoples beliefs amount to nothing</b>

Like I said, since no record was written in proper account, it denounced his credibility, and also, if anything, I was convinced Jesus was a rumor spread by the Vaticans (or the original Jewish or Hebrew counterparts of the original cult) that used "HIM" to market their image to the potential believers.

Just because we dont have a written record of him doesnt mean he loses credibility. This was the old days, they didnt exactly keep good records back then.

Also this theory that jesus was a rumor is insulting to me. You have no proof of this, so why claim such non-sense. Stop with this cult crap too, my religion was no darn cult. I know you dont believe man, but respect others beliefs.

hey Buddha here, how is heaven?
joke aside, I guess people do receive comfort from knowing or believing, I would rather be at comfort with myself knowing something proven.

See thats why you dont like religion. You have to have everything proven to you. The whole point of religion is faith. Why must everything have to be proven, wheres you imagination?

Personally i think jesus exist. But Mostly i think it depends on faith weather you think he exist or not.

<quoting Omnidevil' post which is too long to quote so read for yourself>

Not quite right, Omni. The temple mound and Jerusalem was destroyed by the Romans before the word 'Islam' is known to the world. The Templar Knights and the Rosicrucians are about the age of Crusade (middle age, 8-12th century). Well, at this time, the Pope commanded the European armies to gain control of Jerusalem. Well, they did managed to get it back from the moslems and the whole different story about the templars would start here. The temple mound was destroyed by Romans, the Jerusalem later by numerous people and groups including Arab.

Thanks for the info, but again, I cannot quite agree with it. The Catholics is not a religion. It's a country. And a country who took Christianity as its core. So, Catholics was not the original. The original of Christianity was not Jesus's group either. The original was a handful of people who gathered in Judea defending their belief that Jesus was the Son of God, the Messiah. And fyi, these people hadn't gathered until some years after the crucifixion of Jesus. And again, considering the danger of such masses gathering in the heart of Jewish and Roman rule, the only passable note about Jesus can be found in letters and journals of His apostles and disciples (more than 12 see..) These would later be collected and compiled into a book (selected ones, of course)...

There's only two possible reason for a great empire which conquered a large portion of Europe and Middle east to simply took a person from a Judean kingdom (under its imperialistic order) and bethroned him as a God replacing a line of lesser gods they had spent tons of golds building their temples: either insanity of its emperor, or simply a divine enlightment. We'll save the latter for later. It's still a question. Why would Roman empire took Jesus as a God and assuming the Roman Christian Empire? To win the heart of Judean people? Not in anyone's right mind.

As for the papers and documents. It's a great chance that those documents still intact in the library in Vatican or somewhere in this world. As I wrote before, the bible only comprises of selected few gathered by the Nicea council to support His Divine attribute. The original (and the rest of the) records including those possibly written by Jesus Himself (which later brought into controversy in books such as Da Vinci Code which I found quite non-fictional) could either be kept by vatican or destroyed along with the temple mound and the city (see, the Jerusalem is a war-magnet).

And, no. The Roman doesn' hate Jesus. Jewish does.

Side Note:
About 400 years after Jesus, a group of people led by a youth from Arab start spreading a religion in the middle east area (mostly the Arabian peninsula and the gulf). The birth of Islam is after the birth of Christianity (the Roman Catholic Empire). It would be veeery strange that this Religion also took the name Jesus; not as a God or Son-of-God, but as a prophet. Should Jesus a phony, then Islam is also a phony (double that cos no idiot is more idiot than an idiot who follows idiots). Let's leave the discussion of Islam low for now, cos this bears another significant ties with the Jesus-Christian-Catholic-Vatican relationship.

Oh yeah. I think aside from his existence, most people would argue over His "Divine Attribute": whether Jesus is God or not.

Also this theory that jesus was a rumor is insulting to me. You have no proof of this, so why claim such non-sense. Stop with this cult crap too, my religion was no darn cult. I know you dont believe man, but respect others beliefs.

don't take offense on what I said about that, every religion must start as a small number of people who follow them, beginning it as a cult, before it is acknowledged and becomes a religion.
Paganism was just the same, the only difference is because no one agrees on them. The same would have applied to Judasism, Buddhism, Taoism, the fundamental difference is how far it goes and has came to convince its members and its members base.
Every other small belief, such as say Scientology is a cult, cause it is not officially like one, there is small memberbase, but like huge religions and mainstreamers, they have their set of rules like all of them, they have their own churches and gathering places of faith, they have all sorts of activities that mainstream religions have, and thus, they are no difference, whether or not they have been acknowledged as a cult or religion largely revolves around external influence and general acknowledgement.
I have no proof? I claim because I dare to ask questions, exactly why this thread would have been born in the first place, when I ask a question, one who believes in faith can only lean back on their faith, while it serves no useful purpose to question them, it would have been good for us, Who do not believe to look at facts over fiction.

Nonetheless, I apologize if I may have offended you in any way, likewise, i did not say in sure that he did not exists, he could have, but like all my other posts, a figurehead set forth by a pre-religion or a group of believers to guide those who wishes to enter the same religion/pre-religion. Possibly like said, I would not have agreed if he has Godly Attributes, however, he was most probably a good leader, hence the leadership he must have had possess and used would have granted those around his faith on him, and thus, with the help of his group, used the image of God and so on to begin his own large religion. This theory is NOT a rumor, it is a theory.

See thats why you dont like religion. You have to have everything proven to you. The whole point of religion is faith. Why must everything have to be proven, wheres you imagination?

I must , cause it is my nature, logical thinking and my education demands that proof be given to maintain believe. I believe there are such things as Atoms, I believe in Humans having the power to evolve, over long periods of time, I believe there is such a thing called Chemical Reaction, which most of these, until shoved up the conservative christian face, it would have denounced as "Heresy", see the difference why I rather choose proof over imagination.

Imaginations only serve a primary purpose to endure when necessary, such as giving faith to those who need it, giving strength of the inner self, psychologically appealing, soothing of thoughts, they work, I did not denounce them, however, like all atheists, I must know the clear line in believing something that is quite possibly (QUITE) not there than believing something that can be proven.
Imagination is good, however it is not necessary, if you recall, I too worked with the RedCross similiar, The Red Cresent welfare home once, and I was compassionate as an atheist, I don't need the backgroun image of an imaginary God to guide my actions, my morals itself and those that I learned from my parents and just as every other education would have been enough to guide me to the correct choice.

Not quite right, Omni.

Aye, I failed in the history lesson, my bad.
Your points have been valid, I just read through more accurate documents and yes indeed it was real.
Indeed, his divine attribute would have been a bigger arguent indeed. I find it often the argument drifts back to this part as well.
Nonetheless, due to the fragmented documentation and selective documentations, I guess one can never prove it. Granted, I guess it never will.

I must , cause it is my nature, logical thinking and my education demands that proof be given to maintain believe. I believe there are such things as Atoms, I believe in Humans having the power to evolve, over long periods of time, I believe there is such a thing called Chemical Reaction, which most of these, until shoved up the conservative christian face, it would have denounced as "Heresy", see the difference why I rather choose proof over imagination.

Imaginations only serve a primary purpose to endure when necessary, such as giving faith to those who need it, giving strength of the inner self, psychologically appealing, soothing of thoughts, they work, I did not denounce them, however, like all atheists, I must know the clear line in believing something that is quite possibly (QUITE) not there than believing something that can be proven.
Imagination is good, however it is not necessary, if you recall, I too worked with the RedCross similiar, The Red Cresent welfare home once, and I was compassionate as an atheist, I don't need the backgroun image of an imaginary God to guide my actions, my morals itself and those that I learned from my parents and just as every other education would have been enough to guide me to the correct choice

Yes, but if you want to truely be wise you must have some imagination and a faith in something. If you dont all you have to keep you warm at night is your facts.


We as humans desire to know the facts and like to understand the world around us. Though we also need a little faith in our lives, or all well be is a heartless un-caring robot. We need a combonation of both to be a complete human being.

One thing I have alwasy hated about questioning the cristian belief is that the believers never want to really answer the questions with fact and they get offended if anyone asks. if the religion is not strong enough to handle questions and want proof then how will it be strong enough to save souls?? The point of belief should be to invite the questions and "doubters" and try to prove the point without being limited to "that is what the bible says and therefore it is true" Isnt that what the bible talks about in doubting thomas? It seems that a lot of believers in this religion want to quote scripture all day that isnt really pertinant and yet they wont admit that they just dont know. This is one of the reasons why I turned away from chritianity a long time ago because when I got old enough to questions, no one wanted to answer and they got angry that I asked like I was a sinner or something. Like I said it cant be that strong a faith if asking questions just leads to anger.

"We all must have imagination and not look at the facts" - Yes, religion is blind. Yes, all religions are false. Yes, there never be a true religion, only Politics. Can I prove it? No. Can you prove me wrong? No.

If you define religion as something lucid, yet hard to understand, needed by everyone, and had grasped into the very fundamental of human life controlling and at some cases at some times gives hopes and miracles to the masses, then money and music is the best religion in the world. These past few years, I consider my belief not a part of the 'Christian' religion, but as a mere follower of God. Religion is what man told you to do. Whether it's inspired by God or not, is open for discussion.