__THISRES__79864.jpg "Fly of Simca by ~pvc24 1 week 3 days ago")
Fable...or Fact?
I'm talking fairies, goblins, trolls, dragons, unicorns, elves, angels and even, to some respect, gods.
How do we know that they're fables? How can we be sure that they are not real?
yes, yes... stupid questions that little children ask mummies and daddies, but hey! How DO we know?
we argue that they originated from figments of some dude's warped imagination but, scientifically, the imagination is greatly linked to reality. The unconscious section of our brains extract bits and pieces from our memories and fuse them together to make what we call 'dreams'. They may be recent or distant, faded memories, however, memories are what we've experienced, seen in real life.
Getting to the point... where did the idea of fairies come from if someone had not really seen them?
on another note, are parallel universes possible? how do we know they're not? i've heard that there is this science lab somehow in europe which has managed to accelerate an atom/electron to such great speeds that it has apparently penetrated through to another dimension. they havent clarified anything, as they're still not sure what's happen to that particle, but don't you see? there IS a possibility that its gone to another world! there's even a website, but i've forgotten it.
the 'magicians'/magic-performing artists of the world are all extremely good deceivers...but have you ever heard of Houdini the great Escapist? it may have all been an act/a great trick to the audience, or perhaps he was talented but maybe there was something else... how can someone chained, locked, and weighed down escape from a closed container of water in barely a minute??
saints only become saints if they successfully perform 3 miracles, i.e. acts of which science can not explain. there are many saints, and so hundreds of miracles have therefore been performed and none have been proven by science. isn't the word 'miracle' somewhat the same as 'magic'? both unexplainable. if miracles can exist, why not magic? How can we be sure that 'magic' does not exist?
How do we know that they're fables? How can we be sure that they are not real?
yes, yes... stupid questions that little children ask mummies and daddies, but hey! How DO we know?
we argue that they originated from figments of some dude's warped imagination but, scientifically, the imagination is greatly linked to reality. The unconscious section of our brains extract bits and pieces from our memories and fuse them together to make what we call 'dreams'. They may be recent or distant, faded memories, however, memories are what we've experienced, seen in real life.
Getting to the point... where did the idea of fairies come from if someone had not really seen them?
on another note, are parallel universes possible? how do we know they're not? i've heard that there is this science lab somehow in europe which has managed to accelerate an atom/electron to such great speeds that it has apparently penetrated through to another dimension. they havent clarified anything, as they're still not sure what's happen to that particle, but don't you see? there IS a possibility that its gone to another world! there's even a website, but i've forgotten it.
the 'magicians'/magic-performing artists of the world are all extremely good deceivers...but have you ever heard of Houdini the great Escapist? it may have all been an act/a great trick to the audience, or perhaps he was talented but maybe there was something else... how can someone chained, locked, and weighed down escape from a closed container of water in barely a minute??
saints only become saints if they successfully perform 3 miracles, i.e. acts of which science can not explain. there are many saints, and so hundreds of miracles have therefore been performed and none have been proven by science. isn't the word 'miracle' somewhat the same as 'magic'? both unexplainable. if miracles can exist, why not magic? How can we be sure that 'magic' does not exist?
This post has been filtered for improved legibility #756829 Quote Report Edited by ~whisprn2dawind 2 months 1 week ago
SPOILER (click to view)
“The difference between an optimist and a pessimist?
An optimist laughs to forget, but a pessimist forgets to laugh.”
Although sometimes or imaginations are linked to reality I don't always believe this to be true. I mean what if the guy to thought of the idea of unicorns was very fond of horses to the point where he imagined a beautiful stallion with mystic powers and a horn. Concerning the other mystical creatures I believe that their existence is only limited to the person's belief. Some of use might believe in the tooth fairy or big ol' Santa with his naughty and nice list. Sometimes even, fables are used to protect us when we were kids. Don't you think it would be easier to tell a kid to be good for that whole year so that santa will put him in the nice list rather than to be good so that he'll grow up well and live a good future?
Parallel universes?? Hmm...I don't know if it is possible?? I mean there has been a lot of speculations about the matter and one time I even saw in yahoo that there's a newly discovered evidence that Aliens DO exist. I didn't open it though.
As for magic and miracles...actually I define it as one and the same as for the Magic that your referring to i define it more of Illusion. David Blaine for example trained for weeks or even months before he does his stunts. AND... concerning the saints.. the reality of this is purely based of belief(which I do not wish to discuses)
To end this fables or fictions or only true to those people who believe in it. Unless, ofcourse, there is a solid evidence to support it(but now it wouldn't be called fiction now would it?). I mean belief made the powerful Egyptians think that their gods were talking to them when ever they came to Kom-Ombo that way the next time they visit the temple they would bring whatever their gods wanted(when in fact the sounds were made by the high priest and since he was the only one who can translate...well you get the picture). Simply said, what you believe in is basically how you look in life.
Parallel universes?? Hmm...I don't know if it is possible?? I mean there has been a lot of speculations about the matter and one time I even saw in yahoo that there's a newly discovered evidence that Aliens DO exist. I didn't open it though.
As for magic and miracles...actually I define it as one and the same as for the Magic that your referring to i define it more of Illusion. David Blaine for example trained for weeks or even months before he does his stunts. AND... concerning the saints.. the reality of this is purely based of belief(which I do not wish to discuses)
To end this fables or fictions or only true to those people who believe in it. Unless, ofcourse, there is a solid evidence to support it(but now it wouldn't be called fiction now would it?). I mean belief made the powerful Egyptians think that their gods were talking to them when ever they came to Kom-Ombo that way the next time they visit the temple they would bring whatever their gods wanted(when in fact the sounds were made by the high priest and since he was the only one who can translate...well you get the picture). Simply said, what you believe in is basically how you look in life.
Yet again, we can't be sure that aliens don't exist.
scientists now know that there are many other universes other than our own. if organisms (i.e. animals, humans, plants) can survive on Earth, how do we know that there aren't other superior beings living somewhere deep in outer space? it's a possibility.
just a quote i picked up:
"Aerodynamically, the bumblebee shouldn't be able to fly, but the bumblebee doesn't know that so it goes on flying anyway." - Mary Kay Ash.
i guess you've made some logical points about the unicorns, fairies, and santa. touché ^-^
scientists now know that there are many other universes other than our own. if organisms (i.e. animals, humans, plants) can survive on Earth, how do we know that there aren't other superior beings living somewhere deep in outer space? it's a possibility.
just a quote i picked up:
"Aerodynamically, the bumblebee shouldn't be able to fly, but the bumblebee doesn't know that so it goes on flying anyway." - Mary Kay Ash.
i guess you've made some logical points about the unicorns, fairies, and santa. touché ^-^
SPOILER (click to view)
“The difference between an optimist and a pessimist?
An optimist laughs to forget, but a pessimist forgets to laugh.”
Rhinos + Horse = Unicorn
Fly + Little Girl = Fairy
Fat man + Sad childhood = Santa
Hope + Tough Childhood = Saint
etc.
Fly + Little Girl = Fairy
Fat man + Sad childhood = Santa
Hope + Tough Childhood = Saint
etc.
My claimed emoticon 
hi-mizuSometimes even, fables are used to protect us when we were kids. Don't you think it would be easier to tell a kid to be good for that whole year so that santa will put him in the nice list rather than to be good so that he'll grow up well and live a good future?
Did you say heaven and hell?
Getting too close to religion . . .
Aborted by user.
"You're the same as us. We have no past, no future. We live in the moment. That's our only purpose."
Just so you know Agon, Fat man + Sad childhood does NOT equal Santa.
completely contradicting my argument, Santa originated from Saint Nicholas. a man with a kind soul who gave gifts to poor/orphaned children. of course, he did other stuff but that's beside the point.
completely contradicting my argument, Santa originated from Saint Nicholas. a man with a kind soul who gave gifts to poor/orphaned children. of course, he did other stuff but that's beside the point.
SPOILER (click to view)
“The difference between an optimist and a pessimist?
An optimist laughs to forget, but a pessimist forgets to laugh.”
whisprn2dawindHow do we know that they're fables? How can we be sure that they are not real?.....How DO we know? ....How can we be sure that 'magic' does not exist?
We'll never know. Questioning/debating things that can't be proven scientifically/physically would only drive us crazy. It's really based on someone's belief in it. I believe in God, but I can't force someone who don't believe and asked for scientific evidence to believe what I believe, because I can't prove if God really exist (I even doubt if someone will ever be able to do it).
Yes, there're those things called miracles. I believe in miracle, but someone else may not believe it. I don't believe if fairies or magic, etc, truly exist, but having some imaginations about them could be really fun :D
hi-mizuDon't you think it would be easier to tell a kid to be good for that whole year so that santa will put him in the nice list rather than to be good so that he'll grow up well and live a good future?
I agree with this statement. There're lots of stories that are being made by adult to make their daughters and sons grow to be good children. There are lots of superstitious that are also being made with the same purpose. For example: You mustn't cut your fingernails at night. If you do it, it means you wish for your parents to die soon. I believe that this story is being made to scare little kids so that the children wouldn't cut their fingernails because it's really dark at night (especially in the past) and they might hurt themselves, etc. Some stories are more attractive and scary for some children so they follow it.
About the parallel universe, alien.. well.. let's wait for what the scientists will find.
About another dimension.. I believe in heaven and hell. I believe in gods, goddesses, spirits, ghosts, etc, and that's what I called as another dimension. We live next to each other. Sometimes our world intertwine/crossing against each other so that we could feel their existence or sometimes see the other creatures. Anyway.. what I mean with gods/goddesses are saints, real people that once lived in the world, not Greece gods/goddesses type which are even though really interesting, there're no evidence they're ever exist.
Regards, Yuki
I hate the cage, I like the sky, I am a bird, I love freedom... Let the wind flow...
There're no wrong decisions, there're only consequences of your choice
@irovashe: no i didn't say hell or heaven. my point was that our parents usually make things up(or superstitions) to prevent us from getting hurt. the santa claus thing was only an example.
Is there a way to find out if the things from folklore were made up from some random guy? Probably not. They say that many myths come from wild imaginations - like how dragons were really komodo dragons, and fairies are really a cross between a butterfly and a tiny girl.
They believe that there are parallel dimensions, and that our universe is just the tip of the iceberg. Parallel dimensions - some say that for every thing that is based on chance, there is a dimension. For example, tossing a coin - there's a chance for heads, and another for tails. In one universe, it will land on heads. In the other, it will land on tails. I have no idea how they thought up that theory. How did they get from probability to parallel dimensions? Maybe a thousand years from now people will scoff at how scientists believed that there were many dimensions. Maybe they'll say that our reasoning was all based on someone with a hyperactive imagination. I'm not saying that alternate dimensions aren't real, I'm just saying that nobody can really know what started it all.
But I digress. I think that, to a certain degree, all of these things exist. But, well, if you believe it exists, it does, really, I suppose. If something exists in your mind, and if you believe it in your heart, it may not exist in the material world, but it certainly does exist.
Magic...miracles...
You have to define "magic" first. "Magic" was probably used first for something that amazed someone. Like a magic trick. (I'm just speculating here.) But there's other kinds of magic, like the magic that happens when people figure out how to work together. Magic can also mean those spells you say. But miracles...is like something that happened according to fate or destiny or some other higher force. I don't know. I just think that magic and miracles aren't the same thing at all. But magic exists.
They believe that there are parallel dimensions, and that our universe is just the tip of the iceberg. Parallel dimensions - some say that for every thing that is based on chance, there is a dimension. For example, tossing a coin - there's a chance for heads, and another for tails. In one universe, it will land on heads. In the other, it will land on tails. I have no idea how they thought up that theory. How did they get from probability to parallel dimensions? Maybe a thousand years from now people will scoff at how scientists believed that there were many dimensions. Maybe they'll say that our reasoning was all based on someone with a hyperactive imagination. I'm not saying that alternate dimensions aren't real, I'm just saying that nobody can really know what started it all.
But I digress. I think that, to a certain degree, all of these things exist. But, well, if you believe it exists, it does, really, I suppose. If something exists in your mind, and if you believe it in your heart, it may not exist in the material world, but it certainly does exist.
Magic...miracles...
You have to define "magic" first. "Magic" was probably used first for something that amazed someone. Like a magic trick. (I'm just speculating here.) But there's other kinds of magic, like the magic that happens when people figure out how to work together. Magic can also mean those spells you say. But miracles...is like something that happened according to fate or destiny or some other higher force. I don't know. I just think that magic and miracles aren't the same thing at all. But magic exists.
"Santa originated from Saint Nicholas"
the name yes, the deeds, and the magic no. santa was originally protrayed as an evil gnome. it wasn't until not the late 1800's or early 1900's that he took on the form of a jolly fat man, and that form was drawn as an advertisement for a store, so peopel would buy more. the current version of santa is simply commercial. look your the history of him and you'll see. also saint nicholas wasn't that great, many of the saints were very malicious, and did what people would see as evil deeds. their sainthood was granted more from catholic politics than actual deeds. look them up, and use neutral sources, not religion.com, or christianity.com. you'd prolly be better off reading the actual catholic encyclopedia, the book, not online, in your hand, than looking things up there. they bias, and cut info out.
the name yes, the deeds, and the magic no. santa was originally protrayed as an evil gnome. it wasn't until not the late 1800's or early 1900's that he took on the form of a jolly fat man, and that form was drawn as an advertisement for a store, so peopel would buy more. the current version of santa is simply commercial. look your the history of him and you'll see. also saint nicholas wasn't that great, many of the saints were very malicious, and did what people would see as evil deeds. their sainthood was granted more from catholic politics than actual deeds. look them up, and use neutral sources, not religion.com, or christianity.com. you'd prolly be better off reading the actual catholic encyclopedia, the book, not online, in your hand, than looking things up there. they bias, and cut info out.
Maybe thats why I hate science.
I'm an artist to the fullest extent. An animator. My life relys on my ability to cross over from reality into a fairytale and pick and choose what to share with people. Some people are so caught up in having to be "right" and having to prove to the world that their theory was correct that it takes all the magic and mystery out of things. I'm not saying I believe in unicorns or dragons or anything. What I AM saying is the world has some mysteries, like for example, the loch ness monster. Some people claim to have seen it, and some want to prove it's impossible. Whether it was proven to exist or not, it would be a disappointment because the "what if" factor would be gone. But scientists just have to stick their nose in and dig around.
I usually don't discuss topics like this, and anything else with scientific fact vs imagination/faith/belief because it can destroy my ability to be creative. I don't care if things are fact or fiction, real or myth, and I don't see why people are so obsessed with proving everything. Children today already suffer form a lack of imagination due to the way schools are run (and not just in the US mind you). I was fortunate enough to be born before all that technology took over.
Anyways, my point is, it shouldn't matter if dragons and faeries exist or not, because at least they're something thats not from a textook. The imagination is incredibly powerful, and without mine, well, I'd be out of a job. I think we need more unicorns and loch ness monsters in this world, whether they truly exist or not.
I think that came off a bit scatterbrained. Tat would be because I'm at work and doing a good 5 things at once, so excuse me if that made less sense than intended.
I'm an artist to the fullest extent. An animator. My life relys on my ability to cross over from reality into a fairytale and pick and choose what to share with people. Some people are so caught up in having to be "right" and having to prove to the world that their theory was correct that it takes all the magic and mystery out of things. I'm not saying I believe in unicorns or dragons or anything. What I AM saying is the world has some mysteries, like for example, the loch ness monster. Some people claim to have seen it, and some want to prove it's impossible. Whether it was proven to exist or not, it would be a disappointment because the "what if" factor would be gone. But scientists just have to stick their nose in and dig around.
I usually don't discuss topics like this, and anything else with scientific fact vs imagination/faith/belief because it can destroy my ability to be creative. I don't care if things are fact or fiction, real or myth, and I don't see why people are so obsessed with proving everything. Children today already suffer form a lack of imagination due to the way schools are run (and not just in the US mind you). I was fortunate enough to be born before all that technology took over.
Anyways, my point is, it shouldn't matter if dragons and faeries exist or not, because at least they're something thats not from a textook. The imagination is incredibly powerful, and without mine, well, I'd be out of a job. I think we need more unicorns and loch ness monsters in this world, whether they truly exist or not.
I think that came off a bit scatterbrained. Tat would be because I'm at work and doing a good 5 things at once, so excuse me if that made less sense than intended.
Sifting to the bottom, every day for two...All energy funnels, all becomes you
I get your point kalico, but science is not only about that, in fact it has a lot to do with imagination and creativity, and not so much with formulas and cold facts as most of the people seem to think. In my opinion art is a great companion for science and vice versa. It's great to have a wild imagination but not good to confuse it with reality, there's simply not enough food in the whole lake ness for such a monster to survive there.
And since I love quotes:
And since I love quotes:
Read more... (click to view)
"You're the same as us. We have no past, no future. We live in the moment. That's our only purpose."
@kalico: Well, imagination is a great thing, I will agree to that, but without the ability to execute what your imagination. What is imagination? Our own abilities to think creativity. Or as crudely ripped from wikipedia
While I do agree all schools in this world aren't great. However, to say that schooling causes a reduction in creativity is pushing it. We educate for the purpose of giving people a broader perspective on life, whether they agree with it or not. Thus, I really don't see why you blame the educational system here. Of course, this is not the execution that we look at but the idea. Since, what is this but a long list of ideas.
Whether or not things really exist is pretty irrelevant to our own beliefs. Example? Christmas. Most of the adult population knows about this Holiday, and the meaning and how
We all live within our own worlds. Whether we choose to believe it or not, we are not able to see the scope of everything.Fable or fiction, does it really matter? If you believe things hard enough, then you will act according to those beliefs. And then they are real to you.
@irov: I agree that we must distinguish between reality and imagination because well they are fairly different things, and as much as we want them to be the same, who are you to say so?
I don't think people like imagination, it is easy to do, just sit around and wait, but I think the real problem is that people aren't able to express our own imaginations.wikipediaImagination is the ability to form mental images, or the ability to spontaneously generate images within one's own mind.
While I do agree all schools in this world aren't great. However, to say that schooling causes a reduction in creativity is pushing it. We educate for the purpose of giving people a broader perspective on life, whether they agree with it or not. Thus, I really don't see why you blame the educational system here. Of course, this is not the execution that we look at but the idea. Since, what is this but a long list of ideas.
Whether or not things really exist is pretty irrelevant to our own beliefs. Example? Christmas. Most of the adult population knows about this Holiday, and the meaning and how
SPOILER (click to view). But really, whether he is really there, we want to believe in him, because he is pure and good just like all happy things. As long as we believe, then they do exist for us. As a child, if at Christmas, a gift you have been wanting for ages appears. Then screw all the science in the world, he will believe Santa is there. No matter the religous meaning or orgins, no matter the poverty and death that exist during that day, that child is engulfed in its own world. And the rest of the world doesn't exist for him.
We all live within our own worlds. Whether we choose to believe it or not, we are not able to see the scope of everything.Fable or fiction, does it really matter? If you believe things hard enough, then you will act according to those beliefs. And then they are real to you.
@irov: I agree that we must distinguish between reality and imagination because well they are fairly different things, and as much as we want them to be the same, who are you to say so?
On the Gates to Hell inscribed-
Through me you enter into the city of woes
Through me you enter into eternal pain,
Through me you enter the population of loss.
Abandon all hope, ye who enter here.
~Dante's Inferno
誰と思うてある？
Criticism more helpful than praise.
Discussion implies you read/listen to other peoples arguments.
Hail nothing full of nothing, nothing is with thee.~Ernest Hemingway
iroveasheI get your point kalico, but science is not only about that, in fact it has a lot to do with imagination and creativity, and not so much with formulas and cold facts as most of the people seem to think.
Oh, I'm well aware. My cousin is an engineer for GE, so I know that theres creativity in science. But still, the reason I dislike it is for the other side...the part that has to take theory and fairytale and try and disprove or prove it.
Also, the Loch has deep deep channels that run out to the ocean, so it is possible that a creature of that size could lie there, and then go out to the sea. Not saying it's the way it is, just saying it's an option.
gogotheeWhile I do agree all schools in this world aren't great. However, to say that schooling causes a reduction in creativity is pushing it. We educate for the purpose of giving people a broader perspective on life, whether they agree with it or not. Thus, I really don't see why you blame the educational system here.
I'm sorry, but America puts sports first and creativity second. Why do I say that? When I was in High School, I wanted to be an artist. I was told I could not take more than one art class a year by my guidance counselor because it would get in the way of "my studies". Even after I explained to her what I wanted to do she still told me no. Not like that stopped me. I took several art classes a semester, but I got in trouble for it. In my district, art and music have always been "optional". But playing sports and Gym has always been mandatory. Thats just wrong. I agree you can be creative in other ways, but most people are not creative enough to be creative using math and science. Even if people don't take art class seriously, at least their mind is opening up. And don't even get me started on what people said when I said I would be going to art school. I believe some things were said like..."Well, you could at least do something useful to society" or "why are you wasting your parents money?" and "art? animation? I think it's time for you to grow up". So excuse me if I am a bit bitter. What careers were suggested instead? Psychology, engineering, any form of doctor. Seeing a trend here.
The educational system does not necessarily kill creativity, but it does NOT nurture it either. And I went to school in a very good HS, in a state that is in the top 10 every year, so it's not like I went to school in Arizona (ranked last pretty much every year) and am saying this.
Sifting to the bottom, every day for two...All energy funnels, all becomes you
kalicoI think we need more unicorns and loch ness monsters in this world, whether they truly exist or not.
ahh... the Loch Ness monster...anyone seen "The Water Horse" ?
apparently based on a true 'story'. yes...it might be true but still a story... yet, it makes you wonder if Nessie did exist at one stage or not.
that infamous photo might be real after all...
SPOILER (click to view)
“The difference between an optimist and a pessimist?
An optimist laughs to forget, but a pessimist forgets to laugh.”