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sadly, they are small fry compared to the Shinigami's and it's way too easy. why they need to fight them one on one? even if the whole X-cution fight against Renji, they won't win at all with that kind of level.
As depicted, i think after the battle with Aizen, all they did is to train continuously for the past 17 months. usually their laid back after every battle and they don't take it to their hearts but i guess Aizen wasn't just anyone.
we'll probably see Ikkaku and Byakuya's finale before we get to see Zangetsu's grand return.
Next: Rukia is gonna beat Riruka with her ugly drawings LOL because Riruka's dolls are now match for her Icing Tsugi no mai powers.
Yeah, X-cution is a Joke, with the exception of Kuugo, it seems like nobody there really developed their Fullbring to their Maximum potential as it was supposed to be. They have badly underestimated the Shinigami squad.
I think Ichigo was the only one who was able to unconsciously unleash the maximum potential of Fullbring thanks to his natural born spiritual energy. I mean those things always happened to him as soon as he was on the verge of death.
I think Ishida is only in the way in Ichigo's fight, I guess, and he might end up as a last minute hostage, if he isn't careful...
Riruka's fullbring brings life to whatever she loves right? well in that case, there's no greater love than Rukia's love for her drawings. lol.. this is one fun fullbring vs Shinigami.
well, almost all members of X-cution have tricky abilites except for Kuugo. most of them are just for support and not for offensive. Kuugo's the one which has the right level to be considered as an opponent but he's only coming to his worst nightmare.. Zangetsu.
if there's any consolation for Ishida, he'd be there just to explain things through.. or he'll get Ichigo freaked out being an interference.
I am starting to think the most important thing in this arc isn't what we are seeing but whatever happened in Kuugo's past and the others of X-cution...I think there's a secret that will change our perspective of the battle...
i know what you're getting into it. not only that, Kuugo being a substitute Shinigami mean a person or two in Gotei 13 and there's also a chance the he is an old acquaintance of Aizen. this and that will eventually evolve into something big.
The time frame makes it very likely that Aizen at least had knowledge of the existence of the fullbringers...knowing him it must have spiked his curiosity...what I am afraid is that we will eventually find out that much like Shinji's group, the X-cution was fooled and marked as an enemy without reason...since the fights are being too easy and the members of X-cution are dying it would be harsh to Ichigo at least...it might trigger the release of his hollow though...
that's what i'm thinking too at it's not far from possibility. like the Vaizards, Aizen must have some connections with the group. anything that has power would suffice to get Aizen's attention.
if so, this is not going to be over from here. fullbringers must have some place in Aizen's plan against the soul king.
The current battle will end soon, Tsukishima may have a background related to something else, cuz Kuugo's power upgrading will not make him a surprisingly badass, it's kinda weird that the Xcution members are forced into this battle, and who's gonna show up when this ends
yes, you're right, Kuugo's power is plain offensive only. Tsukishima's fullbring however is a different story at all. i too think that there's someone behind all these. especially how the Xcution knows to well of all of Ichigo's exploit.
Well, well, well, now. Now we finally start talking aren't we?
Muraki377: You have some great points to emphasize from. Great job. Your assumptions make whole a lot of sense, since Aizen, that cunning snake is a master of setting people up.
The thing with X-cution, IMO must have happened before Aizen trapped Hirako Shinji and his squad members into Vaizard. Kuugo must have been just a brat like Ichigo when he first entered Soul Society and somehow became Shinigami substitute. And since Kuugo knows quite a bit about Isshin and Urahara, he might even know about Ichigo when he was born, so why would he hunt down Ichigo several years later when he was already on the verge of his Final Getsuga Tenshou, train him to achieve Fullbring, snatch it away from him with the intention to smack him to hell???
It may have been, if we take Aizen's evil experiments into account and that Kuggo was really related him, that Kuugo wanted that monstrous power that was possibly implemented into Ichigo, when he was still a baby, because he may have been jealous of Ichigo ever since the day he was born. I mean, it would make sense that Kuugo knows something about Urahara and Isshin, that he would have never imagined...
as far as we know, anything's quite possible with Aizen. there are things that are really so hard to figure out with regards to Aizen. besides, if he was able to hypnotize the whole Soul Society, what the difference now?
what if the fullbring conversion of Ichigo was part of Aizen's plan. what if from the start, he was trying to capture Engetsu and failed and then resided to target Ichigo's Zangetsu. it's possible that Aizen still plans to create the most powerful being to be successful in his plan and so far, Ichigo's on top of his list.
look at this way, how did the group came to know everything about Ichigo and what did Kuugo meant about Isshin and Urahara's real business. Kuugo's pretty young to have known all of these matter and weaklings like him aren't credible to know everything.
moreover, as mentioned before, Xcution might be just some test subjects like the Vaizards and if they aren't Aizen's lab-rat then it all means big trouble for Ichigo and the Soul Society.
The only thing I can't agree with your idea is the timeline...the events of the turn back the pendulum happened 100 years or more I am not sure before the events that made Ichigo into a shinigami...since Kuugo was only a substitute shinigami we have to assume, at least for now, that he was alive and human like Ichigo and susceptible to the normal aging of a human man...so I don't think the timeline could be the one you mentioned...but the rest is very likely...we know Isshin left Soul Society for some reason...it might have been because of something related to X-cution and Ichigo's power...and I absolutely agree that there's something Kuugo knows about Urahara and Isshin...and probably Ryuuken...it's the only thing that makes Ishida's presence logic in Ichigo's and Kuugo's battle.
so if there were really some interactions between Aizen and Kuugo, then it must have happen around the time when Ichigo met Rukia and started being the new substitute shinigami.
there's also the question of Kuugo's past and how Soul Society concealed his identity and existence so far. i bet even Soul Society have no idea of what Kuugo's reasons are for defecting.
Well the issue about the time line was my idea, and I guess I am the one who is mistaken, taking into account that Kuugo is indeed a Human as well, just as Ichigo and his friends, he couldn't be so much older than Ichigo. I guess Kuugo was in his late Teens just when Ichigo was born, and the timeline for Shinigami and Human beings, as far as I know must be way beyond stretches, meaning that Shinigami must be older than the ordinary human being despite their good looks,... I mean if I recall correctly, is it true that the Human life span is shorter than that of a Shinigami?
i just hope he's not using one of Urahara's doll to hide his spiritual essence just like Urahara himself. since he is a shinigami, we can't deduct that possibility so easily. then also, the fact the he was saying something about Ichigo's father which even from Yama-gi, we haven't heard anything from by which he can ask Ichigo.
if it is all legit, then Kuugo and Tsukushima must have been hiding something, not an enormous power, but a tale to break this mystery about Isshin.
Your question is very good Maxi-Ryu99...that is something that I think is never told in Bleach...I think they have a normal lifespan simply because the real world of bleach seems to be normal in that aspect...but it's pure speculation..
You might be right Elleztim...I am remembering that Hitsugaya was going to say something but Byakuya stopped him...Isshin and Urahara also seemed to know too much about Tsukishima's power for a first contact...and I am also remembering that when Sado was training with Renji, Urahara seemed to come to some sort of conclusion about Sado's power which means he already knew the fullbringers and know the origin of Sado's power.
but it leaves these questions on my mind...
could it be Isshin left Soul Society because of the fullbringers?
if so...were they wronged or were they already the bad guys and they tricked him?
if they were the good guys and Isshin tried to help them why did they turn against his son now?
it's apparent that Isshin and Urahara were familiar about Tsukushima and probably Kuugo as well. it might be because during the service of Isshin and Urahara, Kuugo was already a sub shinigami. then that means, Kuugo is a pure shinigami just like Urahara and what about Isshin?
it's not only the fact that Urahara knew something about fullbringers but there's also a missing link. do you guys remember that Inoue and Chad's power manifested only by the time that Ichigo attained his shinigami powers. it must also mean that Ichigo affected those two like how the Xcution were using Ichigo's power right now.
How can someone like Ichigo effect his friends, even unconsciously with his Reiatsu?
And talking about Chado and Inue with their natural abilities, I think that tomboyish tough Tatsuki, Ichigo's childhood friend who beat him up in their local Karate Dojo, could be the next one to explore and discover her secret powers, because she could also sort of sense Reiatsu.
But that apart I have a new idea that considers my past theory of Ichigo's origins of his monstrous powers:
Remember when I once said that, Ichigo's mom could have been an Arrancar or Espada??? If that's the case, the thing that you might have never thought about was that, guess what, Tensa Zangetsu originally belonged to her, while Isshin wielded Engetsu. So when Ichigo was born something must have happened in a sense that forced her mom to prematurely pass on Tensa Zangetsu into Ichigo on the day he was born, and considering the fact that Tensa Zangetsu was originally Aizen's creation and a failed Prototype Arrancar experiment as well. It's simple as that, that the easiest way to inherit Hybrid Hollow powers was from one's own mom.
Then Urahara and Isshin must have could have done something to prevent Ichigo from going completely Arrancar... and talking about that, maybe Kuugo played a part in it to, when he was obviously fooled by Urahara and Isshin somehow and thus forced to sacrifice his Substitute Shinigami powers along with his incomplete raw Fullbring powers, in order for Urahara's and Isshin's ritual on Ichigo to function well to prevent Ichigo to become a complete Arrancar type Espada.
Wouldn't it be any mystery then, that this was the reason why Kuugo tracked Ichigo from a distance, ever since the day he received Rukia's Shinigami Reiatsu, and just waited for many years, long enough until Ichigo reached the peek of his fullest potential with the Final Getsuga Tenshou to ignite Ichigo's unconscious Fullbring Powers, that weren't strong enough to hold body and Soul together and thus Tensa Zangetsu altogether... and Kuugo ambushed for that moment in order to strike when Tensa Zangetsu, his original protector was gone, so Kuugo wouldn't have had a problem to deal with a Shinigami Substitute who lost all his Reiatsu.
Think about that, I think Tensa Zangetsu would have been too much to handle for Kuugo, if Tensa Zangetsu dwelled inside of Ichigo. So in other words he could have feared Tensa in its fullest form. So Kuugo would have had a reason to hate Ichigo and his family, for taking away his most prestigious powers as a Substitute Shinigami, and years later he was planning a vandetta to get those powers back, as soon as Ichigo completed the Final Getsuga Tenshou and lost all his Shinigami powers and Tensa Zangetsu...
@elleztim: In other words, you could have made a point when you once said that Kuugo wasn't all that powerful, as I claimed. I mean Tensa Zangetsu could have known Ginjou Kuugo and for some reason hated him from the bottom of his heart.
lol.. for a second there, after reading your theory, i nearly thought that we were talking about Naruto because you stated some clear parallelism with a very common factor in the form of Kyuubi = Tensa Zangetsu. well, as mentioned before, it was already surprising to know that Isshin wielded a similar Zanpakutou like his son. so similar that even the techniques up to the final getsuga was the same.
the only thing that creates a conflict with your theory is that how come a low-level hollow like Grand Fisher was able to kill an Arrancar (considering the theory that Ichigo's mother is an arrancar)? Don't worry about it, as i've thought that maybe her mother already have used the Final Getsuga as well that's why she became so powerless.
then, wasn't it because Ichigo, during the time when Urahara was helping him gain Shinigami powers, after staying dead with the chain of fate broken failed to recover while the Chain of Fate corroded directly to his hole which in turn made Ichigo into a hybrid shinigami-hollow. the part which confuses me is that how Ichigo was able to retain his humanity/shinigami part because the hollow part is the one that was explained properly?
i also don't think that everything was an accident. rather, i think Urahara had some agreement with Isshin to do the actions he made for Ichigo. there's also a mystery why Isshin had mentioned that Masaki diead 10 years ago while Ichigo was saying that it was only 6 years and mentioned that Ichigo was so close. then, Isshin's remark to Grand Fisher that every captain-level shinigami knows how to hide their reiatsu. all of these had something big beneath it and Isshin is the only key to open up all of these facts.
As for Kuugo, they're just trying to create a big deal out of Ichigo. the thing is, it might be a form of revenge against Isshin but i'm wondering why would they try to give Ichigo an aid to restore his shinigami powers.
Like I said before, the thing that would keep Kuugo back from getting near Ichigo was the fact that Tensa Zangetsu might have posed a threat to him and X-Cution because Tensa would protect Ichigo at all cost whether with Hollow powers or Shinigami Reiatsu, it didn't really matter. The Hollow form and Zangetsu are, as you remember completely one being. And when your theory was right about Kuugo that he wouldn't be so powerful like Aizen, why would he dare to fight a fully energized Ichigo with Final Getsuga Tenshou powers in the first place? And in the mean time I don't think that Kuugo is the type to have that high spirit like Ichigo.
And once Tensa Zangetsu vanished due to the after affects of the Final Getsuga Tenshou, the path would have been clear for Kuugo to reawaken the Fullbring powers within Ichigo without having Tensa Zangetsu in his way, because Fullbring is a completely different source of power as we have mentioned it so many times before. In other words Kuugo awakened Ichigo's power to get back what was originally his invention as Substitute Shinigami.
that's true, so far in Bleach universe, Tensa Zengetsu is the most powerful being and it's not limited to that. Tensa is also the most skilled and highly experienced being. he knows exactly the full potential of Ichigo and bares no fear at all.
IMO, he is the most fitting to match the soul king and probably the one that the hougyoku fears the most. is it possible that Urahara wants Ichigo to improved so much so he can definitely detroy the hougyoku?
I have been reading all of the posts...
first...it was implied earlier in Bleach that Ichigo was the cause of so many of his friends gaining powers because of his monstrous reiatsu...but Aizen revealed later that it was the hougyoku that gave them the wish of their hearts...since the city was special they had already a predisposition to have such powers and the hougyoku simply speeded things...Sado and Inoue were the most affected but if we look closely at Keigo for instance it's very likely that we will become a shinigami eventually...after all he did wield a shinigami sword...
I think your theory Maxi-Ryu99 about Tensa and Kuugo and Ichigo's mother is very possible and would explain everything that's been happening...but I would add another theory to the events of Masaki's death...
what if it wasn't grand fisher who attacked her? For me there is something that never made sense in all of that...why doesn't Ichigo remember anything from the attack?...he saw the boy lure and ran to him followed closely by his mother...and then nothing...he doesn't even remember being attacked...my theory is that the hollow took control of him seeing the danger he was heading and probably attacked Masaki and left her unconscious or near death and grand fisher finished the job...and also...I think the best evidence that Masaki was probably an espada was the fact that her spirit managed to remain inside of Grand Fisher
latest chapter of Bleach:
looks like gameboy just got bugged by Hitsugaya. it'quite fast as well like the rest.
the fun part, so Ikkaku got figured out the jackpot fullbring of his opponent and so he pushed everything just to have his opponent's luck to run out. i guess, it is luckier to be stronger. lol..
in addition: it's also worth noting that when the grand fisher returned to Karakura where he accidentally met and fought Isshin, he said that he finally understand why Ichigo was so powerful after Isshin said that he is Ichigo's father. as your theory that Masaki wasn't killed by the Grand Fisher, i think it was theorized before the maybe the Grand Fisher was Aizen's eyes and ears in Karakura and it might be that Aizen was the one who killed Masaki.
though, he would mentioned it to Ichigo if that were the events at the past. still, with Aizen's Kyouka Suigetsu, it's so hard to know which event did really happened.
yeah...all of the questions seem to revolve around their family's past.
About this week's chapter...only Ikkaku would drop his sword in favor of a fist fight! Next week must be Rukia's fight...
they said that after this substitute shinigami arc, there'd be 2 final arcs. it would be fitting to say that the next arc would then tackle the history behind Isshin's shinigami life and Ichigo's sisters awakening.
wherever you look, there is something different with Ichigo's family, all of them have unique abilities related to reiatsu and only her mother's background was the last to be foretold.
With one hard head, Iakkaku crushed the skull of his younger stubborn kid. That's why kids should shut the f$#@ up, when Shinigamis talk, or otherwise get BUTT in the head, remember that when you were reading the latest edition of the Bleach Manga.
@elleztim: How do you know that there will be two more arcs, where do you get your information from?
Next up should be Rukia, because Byakuya's fight is obviously a highlight before the epic battle between Ichigo, (Ishida :P) and Kuugo. I think when Rukia draws her ugly pictures and Riruka accidently uses her power to put life into them, it's all over LOLOLOLOOOOLLLL!!!!!
LOL LOL! I don't think I want to see Rukia's drawings come to life...I don't think I can handle a Cchappy the size of the pig that Riruka created without falling to the floor and laughing for 24 hours straight lol.
I read in a forum that there would be another two arcs after the arrancar arc...one shorter that I think it's this one and one longer...also Kubo said there was going to be another pendulum arc in a interview....does it match your information Elleztim?
@Maxi-Ryu99: it was in another forum, it was revealed after the battle with Aizen. the substitute Shinigami arc was a transitional arc prior to the last 2.
@Muraki3777: yes, that's the same info i got so hopefully the upcoming pendulum arc would include Isshin right away.
lol.. Rukia's fight will be the calm before the storm and there'd be two storms here, one is Byakuya's much anticipated full of pride battle with Tsukushima and then the other is the vengeful return of Tensa. of course, i was just exaggerating with the word vengeful but i do like the sound of the fullbring return of Zangetsu.
Well I think it is high time that we get to know something about Isshin's past and his relationship with the Captain Commander, Urahara, his wife, Aizen and possibly Ginjou Kuugo who seemed to be Isshin's replacement.
but you know, Masaki being an arrancar isn't far off the window. If Ichigo received Zangetsu from Isshin, the hollow core inside him might possibly Masaki's. from there on, Aizen might want that to evolved to its final form, one that is far stronger than the final getsuga and more stable of course.
@Muraki3777: yes it is, because Aizen have said before that a lot of Ichigo's trials were his own device. his purpose were not yet disclosed but there's all the thing about Isshin and Urahara always helping Ichigo to attain power.
remember, Hougyoku wasn't destroyed, and it still hungers for a perfect embodiment of its will and the one person i know next to Aizen is either Ichigo or Zangetsu himself.
It would most likely put Ichigo at the level of the King of Soul Society...the possibilities are endless if we think about what happened to Aizen...but the Hougyoku is fickle since it follows the heart of the person it's fused to...presuming that Ichigo's powers finally stabilize the problem will be his heart...I don't think he has the maturity to deal with it...Aizen didn't have it...Zangetsu on the other hand might be the perfect answer...if the hougyoku fused with him instead of Ichigo the balance would be easier to keep since Zangetsu isn't ruled by his emotions like Ichigo
there is probably some link between Ichigo and the Soul King. wait, i remember Urahara mentioned two beings, one is the Soul King and the other is (if i'm not mistaken) the Spirit King.
which one of them has a key relation to Ichigo. Urahara said something about them being Aizen's main target which could very destroy the chain in Soul Society.
another thing, you remember that the main reason why Urahara's seal takes effect on Hougyoku inside Aizen is because of Ichigo's FInal Getsuga. perhaps, when Ichigo activated the final getsuga, the HOugyoku stops giving power on Aizen and tries to focus on Ichigo.
but, we all know that inside the Final Getsuga, Tensa Zangetsu was becoming fused with Ichigo himself right.
![Nekomimi [Vector]](https://content1.animepaper.co/thumbnails/box/minute/160116/animepaper.net_vector_box_artists_tomose_shunsaku_nekomimi_%5Bvector%5D_160116_etlyng_minute-cd17d7c6.jpg "Nekomimi [Vector]")
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1 year, 7 months ago
sadly, they are small fry compared to the Shinigami's and it's way too easy. why they need to fight them one on one? even if the whole X-cution fight against Renji, they won't win at all with that kind of level.
As depicted, i think after the battle with Aizen, all they did is to train continuously for the past 17 months. usually their laid back after every battle and they don't take it to their hearts but i guess Aizen wasn't just anyone.
we'll probably see Ikkaku and Byakuya's finale before we get to see Zangetsu's grand return.
1 year, 7 months ago
Next: Rukia is gonna beat Riruka with her ugly drawings LOL because Riruka's dolls are now match for her Icing Tsugi no mai powers.
Yeah, X-cution is a Joke, with the exception of Kuugo, it seems like nobody there really developed their Fullbring to their Maximum potential as it was supposed to be. They have badly underestimated the Shinigami squad.
I think Ichigo was the only one who was able to unconsciously unleash the maximum potential of Fullbring thanks to his natural born spiritual energy. I mean those things always happened to him as soon as he was on the verge of death.
I think Ishida is only in the way in Ichigo's fight, I guess, and he might end up as a last minute hostage, if he isn't careful...
1 year, 7 months ago
Riruka's fullbring brings life to whatever she loves right? well in that case, there's no greater love than Rukia's love for her drawings. lol.. this is one fun fullbring vs Shinigami.
well, almost all members of X-cution have tricky abilites except for Kuugo. most of them are just for support and not for offensive. Kuugo's the one which has the right level to be considered as an opponent but he's only coming to his worst nightmare.. Zangetsu.
if there's any consolation for Ishida, he'd be there just to explain things through.. or he'll get Ichigo freaked out being an interference.
1 year, 7 months ago
I am starting to think the most important thing in this arc isn't what we are seeing but whatever happened in Kuugo's past and the others of X-cution...I think there's a secret that will change our perspective of the battle...
1 year, 7 months ago
i know what you're getting into it. not only that, Kuugo being a substitute Shinigami mean a person or two in Gotei 13 and there's also a chance the he is an old acquaintance of Aizen. this and that will eventually evolve into something big.
1 year, 7 months ago
The time frame makes it very likely that Aizen at least had knowledge of the existence of the fullbringers...knowing him it must have spiked his curiosity...what I am afraid is that we will eventually find out that much like Shinji's group, the X-cution was fooled and marked as an enemy without reason...since the fights are being too easy and the members of X-cution are dying it would be harsh to Ichigo at least...it might trigger the release of his hollow though...
1 year, 7 months ago
that's what i'm thinking too at it's not far from possibility. like the Vaizards, Aizen must have some connections with the group. anything that has power would suffice to get Aizen's attention.
if so, this is not going to be over from here. fullbringers must have some place in Aizen's plan against the soul king.
1 year, 7 months ago
The current battle will end soon, Tsukishima may have a background related to something else, cuz Kuugo's power upgrading will not make him a surprisingly badass, it's kinda weird that the Xcution members are forced into this battle, and who's gonna show up when this ends
1 year, 7 months ago
yes, you're right, Kuugo's power is plain offensive only. Tsukishima's fullbring however is a different story at all. i too think that there's someone behind all these. especially how the Xcution knows to well of all of Ichigo's exploit.
1 year, 7 months ago
Well, well, well, now. Now we finally start talking aren't we?
Muraki377: You have some great points to emphasize from. Great job. Your assumptions make whole a lot of sense, since Aizen, that cunning snake is a master of setting people up.
The thing with X-cution, IMO must have happened before Aizen trapped Hirako Shinji and his squad members into Vaizard. Kuugo must have been just a brat like Ichigo when he first entered Soul Society and somehow became Shinigami substitute. And since Kuugo knows quite a bit about Isshin and Urahara, he might even know about Ichigo when he was born, so why would he hunt down Ichigo several years later when he was already on the verge of his Final Getsuga Tenshou, train him to achieve Fullbring, snatch it away from him with the intention to smack him to hell???
It may have been, if we take Aizen's evil experiments into account and that Kuggo was really related him, that Kuugo wanted that monstrous power that was possibly implemented into Ichigo, when he was still a baby, because he may have been jealous of Ichigo ever since the day he was born. I mean, it would make sense that Kuugo knows something about Urahara and Isshin, that he would have never imagined...
What do you think guys?
1 year, 7 months ago
as far as we know, anything's quite possible with Aizen. there are things that are really so hard to figure out with regards to Aizen. besides, if he was able to hypnotize the whole Soul Society, what the difference now?
what if the fullbring conversion of Ichigo was part of Aizen's plan. what if from the start, he was trying to capture Engetsu and failed and then resided to target Ichigo's Zangetsu. it's possible that Aizen still plans to create the most powerful being to be successful in his plan and so far, Ichigo's on top of his list.
look at this way, how did the group came to know everything about Ichigo and what did Kuugo meant about Isshin and Urahara's real business. Kuugo's pretty young to have known all of these matter and weaklings like him aren't credible to know everything.
moreover, as mentioned before, Xcution might be just some test subjects like the Vaizards and if they aren't Aizen's lab-rat then it all means big trouble for Ichigo and the Soul Society.
1 year, 7 months ago
The only thing I can't agree with your idea is the timeline...the events of the turn back the pendulum happened 100 years or more I am not sure before the events that made Ichigo into a shinigami...since Kuugo was only a substitute shinigami we have to assume, at least for now, that he was alive and human like Ichigo and susceptible to the normal aging of a human man...so I don't think the timeline could be the one you mentioned...but the rest is very likely...we know Isshin left Soul Society for some reason...it might have been because of something related to X-cution and Ichigo's power...and I absolutely agree that there's something Kuugo knows about Urahara and Isshin...and probably Ryuuken...it's the only thing that makes Ishida's presence logic in Ichigo's and Kuugo's battle.
1 year, 7 months ago
so if there were really some interactions between Aizen and Kuugo, then it must have happen around the time when Ichigo met Rukia and started being the new substitute shinigami.
there's also the question of Kuugo's past and how Soul Society concealed his identity and existence so far. i bet even Soul Society have no idea of what Kuugo's reasons are for defecting.
1 year, 7 months ago
Well the issue about the time line was my idea, and I guess I am the one who is mistaken, taking into account that Kuugo is indeed a Human as well, just as Ichigo and his friends, he couldn't be so much older than Ichigo. I guess Kuugo was in his late Teens just when Ichigo was born, and the timeline for Shinigami and Human beings, as far as I know must be way beyond stretches, meaning that Shinigami must be older than the ordinary human being despite their good looks,... I mean if I recall correctly, is it true that the Human life span is shorter than that of a Shinigami?
1 year, 7 months ago
i just hope he's not using one of Urahara's doll to hide his spiritual essence just like Urahara himself. since he is a shinigami, we can't deduct that possibility so easily. then also, the fact the he was saying something about Ichigo's father which even from Yama-gi, we haven't heard anything from by which he can ask Ichigo.
if it is all legit, then Kuugo and Tsukushima must have been hiding something, not an enormous power, but a tale to break this mystery about Isshin.
1 year, 7 months ago
Your question is very good Maxi-Ryu99...that is something that I think is never told in Bleach...I think they have a normal lifespan simply because the real world of bleach seems to be normal in that aspect...but it's pure speculation..
You might be right Elleztim...I am remembering that Hitsugaya was going to say something but Byakuya stopped him...Isshin and Urahara also seemed to know too much about Tsukishima's power for a first contact...and I am also remembering that when Sado was training with Renji, Urahara seemed to come to some sort of conclusion about Sado's power which means he already knew the fullbringers and know the origin of Sado's power. but it leaves these questions on my mind... could it be Isshin left Soul Society because of the fullbringers? if so...were they wronged or were they already the bad guys and they tricked him? if they were the good guys and Isshin tried to help them why did they turn against his son now?
1 year, 7 months ago
it's apparent that Isshin and Urahara were familiar about Tsukushima and probably Kuugo as well. it might be because during the service of Isshin and Urahara, Kuugo was already a sub shinigami. then that means, Kuugo is a pure shinigami just like Urahara and what about Isshin?
it's not only the fact that Urahara knew something about fullbringers but there's also a missing link. do you guys remember that Inoue and Chad's power manifested only by the time that Ichigo attained his shinigami powers. it must also mean that Ichigo affected those two like how the Xcution were using Ichigo's power right now.
1 year, 7 months ago
How can someone like Ichigo effect his friends, even unconsciously with his Reiatsu?
And talking about Chado and Inue with their natural abilities, I think that tomboyish tough Tatsuki, Ichigo's childhood friend who beat him up in their local Karate Dojo, could be the next one to explore and discover her secret powers, because she could also sort of sense Reiatsu.
But that apart I have a new idea that considers my past theory of Ichigo's origins of his monstrous powers:
Remember when I once said that, Ichigo's mom could have been an Arrancar or Espada??? If that's the case, the thing that you might have never thought about was that, guess what, Tensa Zangetsu originally belonged to her, while Isshin wielded Engetsu. So when Ichigo was born something must have happened in a sense that forced her mom to prematurely pass on Tensa Zangetsu into Ichigo on the day he was born, and considering the fact that Tensa Zangetsu was originally Aizen's creation and a failed Prototype Arrancar experiment as well. It's simple as that, that the easiest way to inherit Hybrid Hollow powers was from one's own mom.
Then Urahara and Isshin must have could have done something to prevent Ichigo from going completely Arrancar... and talking about that, maybe Kuugo played a part in it to, when he was obviously fooled by Urahara and Isshin somehow and thus forced to sacrifice his Substitute Shinigami powers along with his incomplete raw Fullbring powers, in order for Urahara's and Isshin's ritual on Ichigo to function well to prevent Ichigo to become a complete Arrancar type Espada.
Wouldn't it be any mystery then, that this was the reason why Kuugo tracked Ichigo from a distance, ever since the day he received Rukia's Shinigami Reiatsu, and just waited for many years, long enough until Ichigo reached the peek of his fullest potential with the Final Getsuga Tenshou to ignite Ichigo's unconscious Fullbring Powers, that weren't strong enough to hold body and Soul together and thus Tensa Zangetsu altogether... and Kuugo ambushed for that moment in order to strike when Tensa Zangetsu, his original protector was gone, so Kuugo wouldn't have had a problem to deal with a Shinigami Substitute who lost all his Reiatsu.
Think about that, I think Tensa Zangetsu would have been too much to handle for Kuugo, if Tensa Zangetsu dwelled inside of Ichigo. So in other words he could have feared Tensa in its fullest form. So Kuugo would have had a reason to hate Ichigo and his family, for taking away his most prestigious powers as a Substitute Shinigami, and years later he was planning a vandetta to get those powers back, as soon as Ichigo completed the Final Getsuga Tenshou and lost all his Shinigami powers and Tensa Zangetsu...
@elleztim: In other words, you could have made a point when you once said that Kuugo wasn't all that powerful, as I claimed. I mean Tensa Zangetsu could have known Ginjou Kuugo and for some reason hated him from the bottom of his heart.
What do you think?
1 year, 7 months ago
lol.. for a second there, after reading your theory, i nearly thought that we were talking about Naruto because you stated some clear parallelism with a very common factor in the form of Kyuubi = Tensa Zangetsu. well, as mentioned before, it was already surprising to know that Isshin wielded a similar Zanpakutou like his son. so similar that even the techniques up to the final getsuga was the same.
the only thing that creates a conflict with your theory is that how come a low-level hollow like Grand Fisher was able to kill an Arrancar (considering the theory that Ichigo's mother is an arrancar)? Don't worry about it, as i've thought that maybe her mother already have used the Final Getsuga as well that's why she became so powerless.
then, wasn't it because Ichigo, during the time when Urahara was helping him gain Shinigami powers, after staying dead with the chain of fate broken failed to recover while the Chain of Fate corroded directly to his hole which in turn made Ichigo into a hybrid shinigami-hollow. the part which confuses me is that how Ichigo was able to retain his humanity/shinigami part because the hollow part is the one that was explained properly?
i also don't think that everything was an accident. rather, i think Urahara had some agreement with Isshin to do the actions he made for Ichigo. there's also a mystery why Isshin had mentioned that Masaki diead 10 years ago while Ichigo was saying that it was only 6 years and mentioned that Ichigo was so close. then, Isshin's remark to Grand Fisher that every captain-level shinigami knows how to hide their reiatsu. all of these had something big beneath it and Isshin is the only key to open up all of these facts.
As for Kuugo, they're just trying to create a big deal out of Ichigo. the thing is, it might be a form of revenge against Isshin but i'm wondering why would they try to give Ichigo an aid to restore his shinigami powers.
1 year, 7 months ago
@elleztim:
Like I said before, the thing that would keep Kuugo back from getting near Ichigo was the fact that Tensa Zangetsu might have posed a threat to him and X-Cution because Tensa would protect Ichigo at all cost whether with Hollow powers or Shinigami Reiatsu, it didn't really matter. The Hollow form and Zangetsu are, as you remember completely one being. And when your theory was right about Kuugo that he wouldn't be so powerful like Aizen, why would he dare to fight a fully energized Ichigo with Final Getsuga Tenshou powers in the first place? And in the mean time I don't think that Kuugo is the type to have that high spirit like Ichigo.
And once Tensa Zangetsu vanished due to the after affects of the Final Getsuga Tenshou, the path would have been clear for Kuugo to reawaken the Fullbring powers within Ichigo without having Tensa Zangetsu in his way, because Fullbring is a completely different source of power as we have mentioned it so many times before. In other words Kuugo awakened Ichigo's power to get back what was originally his invention as Substitute Shinigami.
1 year, 7 months ago
that's true, so far in Bleach universe, Tensa Zengetsu is the most powerful being and it's not limited to that. Tensa is also the most skilled and highly experienced being. he knows exactly the full potential of Ichigo and bares no fear at all.
IMO, he is the most fitting to match the soul king and probably the one that the hougyoku fears the most. is it possible that Urahara wants Ichigo to improved so much so he can definitely detroy the hougyoku?
1 year, 7 months ago
I have been reading all of the posts... first...it was implied earlier in Bleach that Ichigo was the cause of so many of his friends gaining powers because of his monstrous reiatsu...but Aizen revealed later that it was the hougyoku that gave them the wish of their hearts...since the city was special they had already a predisposition to have such powers and the hougyoku simply speeded things...Sado and Inoue were the most affected but if we look closely at Keigo for instance it's very likely that we will become a shinigami eventually...after all he did wield a shinigami sword...
I think your theory Maxi-Ryu99 about Tensa and Kuugo and Ichigo's mother is very possible and would explain everything that's been happening...but I would add another theory to the events of Masaki's death... what if it wasn't grand fisher who attacked her? For me there is something that never made sense in all of that...why doesn't Ichigo remember anything from the attack?...he saw the boy lure and ran to him followed closely by his mother...and then nothing...he doesn't even remember being attacked...my theory is that the hollow took control of him seeing the danger he was heading and probably attacked Masaki and left her unconscious or near death and grand fisher finished the job...and also...I think the best evidence that Masaki was probably an espada was the fact that her spirit managed to remain inside of Grand Fisher
1 year, 7 months ago
latest chapter of Bleach: looks like gameboy just got bugged by Hitsugaya. it'quite fast as well like the rest.
the fun part, so Ikkaku got figured out the jackpot fullbring of his opponent and so he pushed everything just to have his opponent's luck to run out. i guess, it is luckier to be stronger. lol..
in addition: it's also worth noting that when the grand fisher returned to Karakura where he accidentally met and fought Isshin, he said that he finally understand why Ichigo was so powerful after Isshin said that he is Ichigo's father. as your theory that Masaki wasn't killed by the Grand Fisher, i think it was theorized before the maybe the Grand Fisher was Aizen's eyes and ears in Karakura and it might be that Aizen was the one who killed Masaki.
though, he would mentioned it to Ichigo if that were the events at the past. still, with Aizen's Kyouka Suigetsu, it's so hard to know which event did really happened.
1 year, 7 months ago
Tite is doing well killing this useless oponents. Now i wanna know more about Isshin
1 year, 7 months ago
exactly, Kubo makes it clear how dominating the Captains and Vice-captain were and it's too much.
same here, we do need an arc especially focused on the Kurosaki family, more so unto Isshin's past life.
1 year, 7 months ago
yeah...all of the questions seem to revolve around their family's past. About this week's chapter...only Ikkaku would drop his sword in favor of a fist fight! Next week must be Rukia's fight...
1 year, 7 months ago
they said that after this substitute shinigami arc, there'd be 2 final arcs. it would be fitting to say that the next arc would then tackle the history behind Isshin's shinigami life and Ichigo's sisters awakening.
wherever you look, there is something different with Ichigo's family, all of them have unique abilities related to reiatsu and only her mother's background was the last to be foretold.
1 year, 7 months ago
Thunderbolts crashin'..., Lightning Bolts thrashin'..., Lucky Punch suckin'..., Headbutt rockin'...
With one hard head, Iakkaku crushed the skull of his younger stubborn kid. That's why kids should shut the f$#@ up, when Shinigamis talk, or otherwise get BUTT in the head, remember that when you were reading the latest edition of the Bleach Manga.
@elleztim: How do you know that there will be two more arcs, where do you get your information from?
Next up should be Rukia, because Byakuya's fight is obviously a highlight before the epic battle between Ichigo, (Ishida :P) and Kuugo. I think when Rukia draws her ugly pictures and Riruka accidently uses her power to put life into them, it's all over LOLOLOLOOOOLLLL!!!!!
1 year, 7 months ago
LOL LOL! I don't think I want to see Rukia's drawings come to life...I don't think I can handle a Cchappy the size of the pig that Riruka created without falling to the floor and laughing for 24 hours straight lol.
I read in a forum that there would be another two arcs after the arrancar arc...one shorter that I think it's this one and one longer...also Kubo said there was going to be another pendulum arc in a interview....does it match your information Elleztim?
1 year, 7 months ago
@Maxi-Ryu99: it was in another forum, it was revealed after the battle with Aizen. the substitute Shinigami arc was a transitional arc prior to the last 2.
@Muraki3777: yes, that's the same info i got so hopefully the upcoming pendulum arc would include Isshin right away.
lol.. Rukia's fight will be the calm before the storm and there'd be two storms here, one is Byakuya's much anticipated full of pride battle with Tsukushima and then the other is the vengeful return of Tensa. of course, i was just exaggerating with the word vengeful but i do like the sound of the fullbring return of Zangetsu.
1 year, 7 months ago
Well I think it is high time that we get to know something about Isshin's past and his relationship with the Captain Commander, Urahara, his wife, Aizen and possibly Ginjou Kuugo who seemed to be Isshin's replacement.
1 year, 7 months ago
but you know, Masaki being an arrancar isn't far off the window. If Ichigo received Zangetsu from Isshin, the hollow core inside him might possibly Masaki's. from there on, Aizen might want that to evolved to its final form, one that is far stronger than the final getsuga and more stable of course.
1 year, 7 months ago
Do you think it's possible that when Ichigo finally evolves to a more stable level of power that the hougyoku will leave Aizen and fuse with Ichigo?
1 year, 7 months ago
@Muraki3777: yes it is, because Aizen have said before that a lot of Ichigo's trials were his own device. his purpose were not yet disclosed but there's all the thing about Isshin and Urahara always helping Ichigo to attain power.
remember, Hougyoku wasn't destroyed, and it still hungers for a perfect embodiment of its will and the one person i know next to Aizen is either Ichigo or Zangetsu himself.
1 year, 7 months ago
It would most likely put Ichigo at the level of the King of Soul Society...the possibilities are endless if we think about what happened to Aizen...but the Hougyoku is fickle since it follows the heart of the person it's fused to...presuming that Ichigo's powers finally stabilize the problem will be his heart...I don't think he has the maturity to deal with it...Aizen didn't have it...Zangetsu on the other hand might be the perfect answer...if the hougyoku fused with him instead of Ichigo the balance would be easier to keep since Zangetsu isn't ruled by his emotions like Ichigo
1 year, 7 months ago
there is probably some link between Ichigo and the Soul King. wait, i remember Urahara mentioned two beings, one is the Soul King and the other is (if i'm not mistaken) the Spirit King.
which one of them has a key relation to Ichigo. Urahara said something about them being Aizen's main target which could very destroy the chain in Soul Society.
another thing, you remember that the main reason why Urahara's seal takes effect on Hougyoku inside Aizen is because of Ichigo's FInal Getsuga. perhaps, when Ichigo activated the final getsuga, the HOugyoku stops giving power on Aizen and tries to focus on Ichigo.
but, we all know that inside the Final Getsuga, Tensa Zangetsu was becoming fused with Ichigo himself right.